Home Forums Hunting Firearms Legislation Florida mass shooting

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  • AvatarBrownItsDown
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    Post count: 1066

    Quote by: mhock

    Makes me wonder how many students were killed in the lat 10 years by fires. I only mention this because so much thought is put into fire codes that are mandated during construction. Important of course, but are we even looking at trying to help prevent some of these incidents through building design? If not, it should be looked at.

    mhock has made a very good point here. On top of this, arming teachers / faculty is a good idea. Just like keeping fire extinguishers in classrooms and sprinklers in ceilings. Heck, I’d even entertain the idea of arming students that meet the legal criteria to carry. The students have entrusted 100% of their personal safety to the school campus, buildings, and adult school faculty, which in-turn, provides them with a false sense of security.

    Avatarmhock
    Participant
    Post count: 3353

    Quote by: BrownItsDown

    Quote by: mhock

    Makes me wonder how many students were killed in the lat 10 years by fires. I only mention this because so much thought is put into fire codes that are mandated during construction. Important of course, but are we even looking at trying to help prevent some of these incidents through building design? If not, it should be looked at.

    mhock has made a very good point here. On top of this, arming teachers / faculty is a good idea. Just like keeping fire extinguishers in classrooms and sprinklers in ceilings. Heck, I’d even entertain the idea of arming students that meet the legal criteria to carry. The students have entrusted 100% of their personal safety to the school campus, buildings, and adult school faculty, which in-turn, provides them with a false sense of security.

    I actually saw on tv last night (don’t remember where, I’m a chronic channel hopper) where zero students have been killed in a fire at school in the last 50 years?!?! No idea on the validity of that or if that is a national stat, but just stuck in my head after raising this point yesterday. If this is indeed the case, it seems to me smarter people than myself should be able to make small changes to help with this issue.

    llewellinsetterllewellinsetter
    Blocked
    Post count: 2514

    Quote by: river

    Quote by: llewellinsetter

    Quote by: river

    Quote by: llewellinsetter

    Quote by: river

    There is a root to this problem and nobody is ever going to talk about it. Nobody

    River

    Apparently you won’t either. 🙄

    Eh? Speak up. I can’t HEAR you. 🙄

    Do you have a point? Suggestion? Solution? Contribution? Anything?

    I certainly do. And thanks for questioning me. I think my point is evident, my suggestions are few, solutions are nil. I’d like to think I can contribute some how, some way. And I pray this humble post is a start. You’re smart ‘setter. I know that from reading stuff here on this site. Between you and I let’s get something started. Let’s find a fix. Let’s talk about it.

    River

    How’s this for an analogy…It’s about progressiveness aka Socialism without the radicals, except the radicals are creeping out of the woodwork and some people are slowly waking to the idea of what’s been happening all around us. Sadly, any form of socialism breeds totalitarianism. People that don’t understand this don’t read real books and have no understanding of history. They read memes from facebook and “news” articles from the propaganda machine, watch the History channel and most haven’t had an original thought since the invention of the smart phone. They simply don’t understand because they have lost the ability of critical thought, if they ever had it.

    As Democrats and certain Republican leaders pushed this 100 yr old + agenda into the 21st Century in painfully slow increasing increments, we as a nation have been losing our American Culture to anti-American Culture where Godlessness is paramount. Human lives have become worthless pawns in an ever continuing battle for supreme power. Even our basic Freedoms, Rights and Liberties no longer matter, mostly thanks to Cultural Marxism propagated by politicians, the elite and mindless celebrities marketing via the media detrimental products and ideas to the highest bidder.

    In short, it’s a war on America and American values – unity, ingenuity, discipline, togetherness, pride, God, community, self-worth, history, dedication, value of law, etc – from within, to replace our Constitution with a elite Socialist system of government, all designed to control us as slaves for the good of the thoughtful and caring leaders.

    People want to blame guns, mental health, TV, culture, more or less laws, etc for these shootings, something tangible to discuss. But it’s not just the shootings, it’s water quality, social issues, education, infrastructure, immigration, etc. . But no one in “power” (government) ever wants to solve the root problems. Why? Because band-aids crate wealth and division, the very things needed to achieve more power.

    Sound about right? So now how do we reverse course?

    Sarcasm entails a few things: one of them is intellect, another one is a sense of humor, and a third - not taking things too personally.

    medicdanomedicdano
    Participant
    Post count: 4987

    Quote by: Renbe4

    Quote by: smokepole

    Quote by: Renbe4

    Quote by: smokepole

    Quote by: river

    There is a root to this problem and nobody is ever going to talk about it. Nobody

    River

    I know what it is. Don’t let liberals have access to guns.

    This was tragic for many people and this guy has to make this very stupid comment. This guy shouldn’t be allowed anywhere near a firearm!

    Aww poor baby the truth hurts when it hits right at home doesn’t it? The facts are it doesn’t matter what gun was used it’s the people using them. If you look at every one of these mass shootings closely you’ll find the common denominator. There have been 51 people shot and killed in Chicago so far this year and it doesn’t even make the national news. Not a word about more gun laws what guns were used, it’s all about politics. But hey it keeps ignorant people like you involved.

    This topic should not be politicized, we will never improve the situation when that happens! Your original statement was ridiculous to make after all these mass murders. No respect for all the people who are going through all these terrible events. You think you know my political affiliation from me not agreeing with you politicizing this issue.

    Now you make another post: Were did I make any statement about what type of gun was used? You must not know what “common denominator” or “every one” mean, I know for a fact a “liberal” did not commit every one of the mass murders, as you state as a fact!??! My last statement from the post is “kind of verified” by your childish name calling in your response. Please don’t “try” to bully people from behind a computer screen.

    All, no. But the vast majority were registered democrats. Of all the murders in Chicago, for example, how many do you think vote republican?? I would venture to say less than 5%.

    nater3nater3
    Participant
    Post count: 2038

    Sadly many people would not support paying for school security. These same people don’t support funding our military. Would they support it if it was there was an immediate threat at their child’s school, or course, but it is too late then. Just like they don’t support our military or police until somebody or some country had a gun aimed at their head or our country is invaded. Too late at that point! There are plenty of teachers like myself who would go through whatever training was asked of me to legally carry while I am working each day. Put me through mental aptitude testing, firearms training, whatever, etc. But give me the right to protect myself, students, and colleagues!

    bowfisherbowfisher
    Participant
    Post count: 2207

    Isnt it kinda ironic that most of these terrible tragedies started after FB hit the mainstream? I know there were some prior to FB but they sure really seem to ramp up after wards.

    Avatarnahdogg
    Participant
    Post count: 212

    Quote by: llewellinsetter

    This should have been prevented. This is another black eye on the FBI and our law enforcement bureaucracy.
    https://www.buzzfeed.com/briannasacks/the-fbi-was-warned-about-a-school-shooting-threat-from?utm_term=.nbyd9GAJQ#.orqlxMke9

    That there appears to be no follow up from the FBI on this tip that was submitted through the field office isn’t surprising – they were likely far too busy chasing down Russian agents – who as the media tells us are the real threat to everyone. /winkwink

    From my reading this was a troubled kid who both his adoptive parents were dead, his mother died in November about 45 days after he said he aspired to be a ‘professional school shooter.’ He bounced from there to a family member and then to a friends house. Unsure of the timing of his expulsion from school from anything I’ve read. There was an armed school security officer present in the building but he did not encounter the shooter. This was a 4000 student complex with multiple buildings the pulling of the fire alarm probably caused chaos which slowed response time for the onsite security. I’ve suggested arming the principal at my kids school but in DMPS that’s a non-starter because schools are a gun free zone. I played out an active shooter scenario in my mind at my kids school and most kids have no egress to escape an active shooter and are protected basically by doors with large windows and a dead bolt. The current protocol which has been engaged once for an active threat (not active shooter in this case) was that the school locked all doors and children sheltered in place. As much as I’d like to see schools safer I don’t think it’s possible without massive changes to building design and multiple armed security guards. When my school can’t afford a full time nurse and only a part time librarian I don’t see them adding security staff. With the problems facing DMPS I think the only solution is homeschooling.

    smokepolesmokepole
    Participant
    Post count: 255

    Quote by: Renbe4

    Quote by: smokepole

    Quote by: Renbe4

    Quote by: smokepole

    Quote by: river

    There is a root to this problem and nobody is ever going to talk about it. Nobody

    River

    I know what it is. Don’t let liberals have access to guns.

    This was tragic for many people and this guy has to make this very stupid comment. This guy shouldn’t be allowed anywhere near a firearm!

    Aww poor baby the truth hurts when it hits right at home doesn’t it? The facts are it doesn’t matter what gun was used it’s the people using them. If you look at every one of these mass shootings closely you’ll find the common denominator. There have been 51 people shot and killed in Chicago so far this year and it doesn’t even make the national news. Not a word about more gun laws what guns were used, it’s all about politics. But hey it keeps ignorant people like you involved.

    This topic should not be politicized, we will never improve the situation when that happens! Your original statement was ridiculous to make after all these mass murders. No respect for all the people who are going through all these terrible events. You think you know my political affiliation from me not agreeing with you politicizing this issue.

    Now you make another post: Were did I make any statement about what type of gun was used? You must not know what “common denominator” or “every one” mean, I know for a fact a “liberal” did not commit every one of the mass murders, as you state as a fact!??! My last statement from the post is “kind of verified” by your childish name calling in your response. Please don’t “try” to bully people from behind a computer screen.

    I don’t normally waste my time with people that have the comprehension skills of a 10 year old, but I guess I will this time. I said if you “look” at every one of the mass shootings you will find a common denominator (I didn’t say everyone) that is fact. My point about what gun was being used was a statement in general not specifically what you said. I can’t help it your emotions get in the way of what really needs to be done but that’s what usually happens during this kind of crisis, politicians count on that. I could care less what your political affiliation is but I don’t need somebody like you telling me what to politicize or who needs respect in any situation.

    AvatarTrapCyclone
    Participant
    Post count: 2552

    Quote by: llewellinsetter

    How’s this for an analogy…It’s about progressiveness aka Socialism without the radicals, except the radicals are creeping out of the woodwork and some people are slowly waking to the idea of what’s been happening all around us. Sadly, any form of socialism breeds totalitarianism. People that don’t understand this don’t read real books and have no understanding of history. They read memes from facebook and “news” articles from the propaganda machine, watch the History channel and most haven’t had an original thought since the invention of the smart phone. They simply don’t understand because they have lost the ability of critical thought, if they ever had it.

    As Democrats and certain Republican leaders pushed this 100 yr old + agenda into the 21st Century in painfully slow increasing increments, we as a nation have been losing our American Culture to anti-American Culture where Godlessness is paramount. Human lives have become worthless pawns in an ever continuing battle for supreme power. Even our basic Freedoms, Rights and Liberties no longer matter, mostly thanks to Cultural Marxism propagated by politicians, the elite and mindless celebrities marketing via the media detrimental products and ideas to the highest bidder.

    In short, it’s a war on America and American values – unity, ingenuity, discipline, togetherness, pride, God, community, self-worth, history, dedication, value of law, etc – from within, to replace our Constitution with a elite Socialist system of government, all designed to control us as slaves for the good of the thoughtful and caring leaders.

    People want to blame guns, mental health, TV, culture, more or less laws, etc for these shootings, something tangible to discuss. But it’s not just the shootings, it’s water quality, social issues, education, infrastructure, immigration, etc. . But no one in “power” (government) ever wants to solve the root problems. Why? Because band-aids crate wealth and division, the very things needed to achieve more power.

    Sound about right? So now how do we reverse course?

    Those are some pretty deep thoughts! How do you feel we should/could reverse course?

    AvatarBrownItsDown
    Participant
    Post count: 1066

    Quote by: mhock

    Quote by: BrownItsDown

    Quote by: mhock

    Makes me wonder how many students were killed in the lat 10 years by fires. I only mention this because so much thought is put into fire codes that are mandated during construction. Important of course, but are we even looking at trying to help prevent some of these incidents through building design? If not, it should be looked at.

    mhock has made a very good point here. On top of this, arming teachers / faculty is a good idea. Just like keeping fire extinguishers in classrooms and sprinklers in ceilings. Heck, I’d even entertain the idea of arming students that meet the legal criteria to carry. The students have entrusted 100% of their personal safety to the school campus, buildings, and adult school faculty, which in-turn, provides them with a false sense of security.

    I actually saw on tv last night (don’t remember where, I’m a chronic channel hopper) where zero students have been killed in a fire at school in the last 50 years?!?! No idea on the validity of that or if that is a national stat, but just stuck in my head after raising this point yesterday. If this is indeed the case, it seems to me smarter people than myself should be able to make small changes to help with this issue.

    Instead of all of the bickering going back-and-forth about this, and any other similar mass homicide, THIS is where people should concentrate their efforts. Offensive acts of violence will never be eliminated. That’s a fact of life. Equipping yourself with proper Defensive strategies is the ONLY way to combat Offensive acts of violence.

    Avatarfowl_attitude
    Participant
    Post count: 602

    Following the discussion here. There are a lot of good points. As a teacher I have been through a relatively new training called ALICE. It is completely different than what we have done for many, many years. For many years we were told to turn off the lights , lock you door and wait quietly. This does nothing but make you a sitting duck. We actually practiced this during the ALICE training with our sheriffs department. It is an unbelievably unnerving thing to hear the threat coming down the hallway and be told you are not to do anything. And yet, that is the policy for most schools. I always thought that was stupid since I have ground level windows. Why would I not take my students out to safety? With the new training, we are now given that option if we think it is the best option. We are also given the option to “fight back”. Use what ever you have to throw or distract. I teach science. I have all kinds of goodies that could be used. Research shows that in these cases shooters move to the easiest targets because they know their time is limited to inflict the damage. We are now told to do what we think is the best for our students. But this is not the training most teachers receive. Most are told to sit and wait. Someone mentioned making doors open inwards. Doors can be kicked in and you don’t have time to move desks or file cabinets in the way. Or the teacher may not be physically able to move something. The solution is a door closer lock. A simple tube that slides over the closer from inside the classroom so the door can not be opened from the outside, even if they have a key. I made some out of PVC, painted them red, and gave them to anyone that wanted one. School resource officers are already used in many larger schools. But with a large school, that means even their response time can be a minute as he gets from one end of the building to the other. What about utilizing teachers who have served in the military? I have 4 colleagues who served in the Afgan or Irag. If anyone is trained to deal with the pressure situation like this, it is them. My point, is there are some options out there.

    AvatarCubby
    Participant
    Post count: 717

    Quote by: medicdano

    This kid illegally had possession of the weapon. The “minimum age to own a firearm” law was in place, as it has been for decades. Laws do not prevent people from being evil. PERIOD!!!!

    Did it say how he got the gun?

    medicdanomedicdano
    Participant
    Post count: 4987

    Quote by: Cubby

    Quote by: medicdano

    This kid illegally had possession of the weapon. The “minimum age to own a firearm” law was in place, as it has been for decades. Laws do not prevent people from being evil. PERIOD!!!!

    Did it say how he got the gun?

    It did not. It was locked up where he was living with grudges but he had access to the key. MSN.

    Avatarnahdogg
    Participant
    Post count: 212

    The shooter was 19, age of ownership in Florida is 18. He could have bought the gun last week. ATF to make a statement today or tomorrow on lineage of gun.

    llewellinsetterllewellinsetter
    Blocked
    Post count: 2514

    Quote by: cage

    Remember Hitler spread his twisted ideology by controlling what was taught to the children. This is where the down fall started and where repairing it must be done.

    Ding Ding Ding.
    The question is, are the PEOPLE that understand this willing to fight to take back control or they just fall in line like good little citizens and go play on facebook and participate in any number of other distractions.

    Sarcasm entails a few things: one of them is intellect, another one is a sense of humor, and a third - not taking things too personally.

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